Steorn is thus far disclaiming the validity of all attempts it has yet examined to replicate its Orbo technology. Will replicators start attending to detail? Steorn's next public experiment is Friday, January 8th. by creator
(libertarian)
Wednesday, January 6, 2010
Steorn became the small Irish "mouse that roared" by claiming a "free energy" technology and then proceeding to enmesh themselves in controversy. Although some observers are very hopeful for proof through independent copies of Steorn's Orbo technology, Steorn have now stated that claims of independent Orbo replication are premature.
The most notable of these claims comes from widely-followed French experimenter, Jean Louis Naudin. Basing his work on information released as part of a public Steorn demonstration, Naudin claimed on December 26th to have partially replicated portions of the Steorn Orbo technology. Specifically, Naudin claimed to have verified Steorn's elimination of back EMF in the Orbo:
"There is no counter electromotive force (Back EMF) induced in the stator coils when the rotor is turned manually."
"No Replications Yet" - Steorn
While acknowledging Naudin's efforts and offering him some encouragement,
"We are quite happy to discuss this in more detail with Jean if he has further interest in replication (two of our engineers are French, so they should be able to communicate well.)"
Sean McCarthy, Steorn CEO, has disagreed with his replication claims, stating that Naudin's results are not in-line with what Steorn themselves have claimed and shown:
Just so that you are aware - we have seen various claims of replications of our system from various sources. However we have been through most of these today and can advise that none of the supposed replications of the core effect are in fact replications at all. Specifically in all the cases that we have examined we are 100% confident that CEMF exists and that this is the primary cause of rotor motion. - Sean McCarthy (from Steorn's public forum)
Sterling Allen of Pure Energy Systems has also reported confirmation of Steorn's disagreement with Naudin's results, publishing this comment from Sean:
Our engineers went through the JLN 'replication' today - both the information on his website and the his youtube channel. We have to advise that this is in no way a valid replication of Orbo. It is very clear to us that the arrangement that he has set up has a significant amount of [Counter]EMF in the system. While not quite a normal pulse motor, it certainly is not Orbo and is almost certainly not OU.
A careful examination of the scope outputs as shown by Steorn on their website and the scope results shown by Naudin and others shows that, while Steorn's scope shots show "flat" current and voltage waveforms, the slopes shown by others indicate the presence of CEMF.
As a simple search on YouTube reveals, other less well known experimenters have also been working to try to duplicate Steorn's thus far demonstrated results, but Steorn have so far disagreed with all the replication attempts they have examined to date.
Next Experiment "Far More Interesting?"
Mr. McCarthy went on to make a rather interesting statement about the next experiment that Steorn plans to webcast on Friday January 8th.
We will be conducting another live experiment this Friday - which we expect will be far more interesting than the one that we did before the Holidays.
This new experiment will undoubtedly be followed by intense controversy from the usual suspects because Steorn claims that it will demonstrate overunity. In a recent email, Steorn has said:
"Sean McCarthy, CEO of Steorn, will discuss Steorn’s Orbo electromagnetic interaction and demonstrate that the Coefficient of Performance is greater than 1."
And with all of the already publicly published photographs, videos, and other information, I am left wondering why those attempting replication seem to be overlooking certain obvious features of the demonstration Orbos?
Too Many Clues In This Room?
Scientists worldwide, divided between outright mockery and vocal outrage over Steorn, claim that Orbo is unscientific rubbish, ruled out by the "laws of nature." Internet trolls dump their vitriolic baggage here and in all Steorn discussion forums. Despite such wide-ranging negativity, quite a few independent investigators besides Naudin have attempted replications based on what has been published so far.
Like the old Gordon Lightfoot song says, I think there are simply "Too Many Clues in This Room." It is very curious to me that at least one publicly displayed salient element of Orbo seems to have been consistently overlooked by would-be replicators who have neither commented on it nor tried in any way to copy it in their designs.
That element is clearly displayed in this illustration, a frame-capture from Steorn's website, which plainly shows there to be two magnets at each position on the Orbo rotor. Replicators, take note! You can find other clues in my last article about Naudin, and in other articles I've written in this series (see list below.)
Will We See "The Holy Grail" on Friday?
I don't expect to. Based on Mr. McCarthy's public statements, I expect to see an experiment that shows more clearly why Steorn believes it has an "over unity" device or process in the Orbo. The experiment itself will no doubt be hotly debated, especially if Steorn does not provide sufficient information for others to conduct their own version of that experiment.
For me personally, the "Holy Grail" of free energy is a self-running system in a Faraday cage producing demonstrable "surplus power" in exess of the energy used to run itself. When I have seen that with my own eyes, I'll report it to you. As a still-optimistic member of "The Steorn 300," I'll leave you for now until further developments.
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TinselKoala (aka Alsetalokin) on YouTube[1] has posted a video[2] (today!) of a dual-magnet setup. His attempts at replication are the most interesting I've seen so far and he's been posting videos at an incredible rate.
You stated above in the article, "Internet trolls dump their vitriolic baggage here and in all Steorn discussion forums.'
Is this your fair assessment on those who do not believe in Steorn's claims?
I think that comment delineates some of the problems with all of this and has been since the beginning of this saga over three years ago. There have been hundreds of perpetual motion claims in the last several hundred years and none of them have ever been proved to be valid. To the scientific community this is tantamount to yelling "fire" in a crowded theater when there is none. And the people who perpetuate this fiction are the first to take disbelievers to task for not just accepting someone's unsubstantiated claim. But leaps of faith are not science. Perhaps it is time to get rid of science and return to Alchemy, Wizards and Witch doctors as it would seem that science is impeding a whole host of miracles from coming forth.
Since you appear to seek truth then understand that the science community runs the gamut from extremely conservative and austere to radical. But for the most part it responds best to solid proof of any claim that can be peer reveiwed with the concommitant experiments duplicated. Since none of that has ever occured with Steorn how else are scientific people to respond to wild claims? Are they to abandon all the facts they have acquired about how the universe works just because someone merely makes a claim? Is that the responsbile way to act? If they did would they not be running from piller to post pursuing all manner of voodoo just because someone said it was true? Is that what you do?
I have followed this story since the beginning and I have found the frustration on the part of people who keep asking for proof and not getting it is precipitating a lot of pushback from them that becomes passionate because they know the scientific method works and has brought many wonderous things to this world operating within the parameters of the scientific method. And it has been the tactic of strong believers to couple the lack of acceptance without proof with an agenda on the part of scientists to either not want it to be true or suppress such discoveries. Nothing could be further from the truth. Wild ideas run rampant in science and all you have to do is look at string theory, multiverses, multiple dimensions and other concepts that are extrapaolated from observation resulting in far reaching speculation. But it isn't science until it is falisfied, duplicated and proven to be true. Wild claims are embraced and treated as de facto truth only to the unscientific minded individuals who do not need proof but only the promise of a dream. Is that what is needed in this world today with all of the major problems that face us? Will wild eyed speculation solve any problem in reality or will it only be a mirage to which we move towards but can never attain as it is in fact an illusion?
Steorn has acted so poorly and unscientific for so long it is hard to take them seriously. They are mocking science and have done so in their marketing and advertising. This is hubris and bluster and better relegated to playing poker and not the laboratory. Blasphemy alone may get you in the headlines but it will not get you into the textbooks.
Steorn has everyone involved sign Non Discolsure Agreements. This serves to ostensibly protect their IP while at the same time preventing the truth from being revealed. There is nothing in the current series of demonstrations that will reveal anything as that would void their attempts to keep this technology secret. So what exactly is the point except to impress the weak minded into their illusion. And yet they have had developers clubs for years who have received all of the information supposedly and no one has been able to replicate this claim.
Thanks for weighing in again as you follow this story! You asked:
"You stated above in the article, "Internet trolls dump their vitriolic baggage here and in all Steorn discussion forums.' Is this your fair assessment on those who do not believe in Steorn's claims?"
No, No, A Thousand Times No! I'm sorry if you got that impression at all. I welcome believers, unbelievers, enthusiasts, the annoyed, anyone who will "play nice" even if they do get somewhat emotional.... I welcome "pushback" as long as there is civility and logic behind it.
My link from the Trolls comment to the wikipedia article was my attempt to make it clear that I will however have no truck with Trolls -- those truly nasty creatures that go beyond honest disagreement into any of the following areas. of assorted nastiness and ad-hominem attacks of all kinds, including but not limited to:
Name calling
Abusive language
Ridicule of the person
Intentionally misleading statements
Misrepresenting who they are with bogus credentials
Obviously I have no problem with pen-names, going by one myself. I do have a problem with revolving-door "name of the day" scum who wear a different mask on alternate Thursdays merely in order to appear rational temporarily.
Quite the contrary, I am very happy to have anyone who is reasonably politely thoughtful, comment on my articles and take me to task logically. If you look at the comments under the history of this article series, you will see that there are comments of both kinds.
I have occasionally been "baited" into unknowingly responding to a Troll; the results have almost always been annoying, and so I've had to develop a better sense of who's who out there.
Bobbotov, you are more than welcome here... I hope I've proven that in the past by the responses I've directed to you personally as well as by the other specific responses I've made to commenters - please see for example my last article in this series, here is one quote directed squarely at you: "Your further comments about why the world is disgruntled with Steorn are points well taken."
Bobbotov, I hope this clears matters up for you? Please picture me rolling out the red carpet, you are quite welcome here! :) Thanks for your thoughtful comments! :)
Thanks again very much for the reference to TinselKoala (aka Alsetalokin.) I watched quite a few of his videos and am very impressed with his work so far.
One of the most interesting experimental results he has shown, that should be of interest to readers here, is his scope traces for open-circuit EMF on his coils. The very most interesting thing is to compare what he saw when he did that test with his single-magnet wheel, and when he repeated the test with his dual-magnet version. The scope results show a stark contrast that should get people thinking!
My hat is off to him, and even more so based on past impressions I've had (perhaps from seeing his comments in some forums?) that he is "an unbeliever." I would rather see ten skeptics who go to the garage or lab and do some playing around with a new idea than a thousand "true believers" completely unwilling to pick up a soldering iron or turn on a drill press. :) These are the ones who will ultimately outweigh the million "raging unbelievers" who already know everything there is to know about life, the universe, and everything. :)
I think Steorn are fairly confident that nobody can replicate the results they claim to have acheived. They can't replicate them themselves and I think they know why, namely, that they are impossible.
Steorn's claims "Over Unity" must pass one simplistic test - insert a current meter in series with the battery, an old analogue current meter, and show me that the device produces some current which CHARGES the battery.
All the rest is just empty bla-bla-bla talk, it is not convincing. I think that Steorn people know that their gadget is not up to such a test - and in turn it means a hoax and failure.
I've been dragged into commentaries on these "free energy" theories multiple times, because it is very intriguing. I always end up at the same place.
1. I think Steorn genuinely believes that he can perfect the system and obtain "Over Unity" output. He seems to be genuine and draws on the speculations of a few dozen scientists who wrote papers on magnetism in the early 20th Century. Obviously, if it were were possible, it would be extremely valuable (a strong motivator in the face of multiple failures.
2. The trappings of his "experiments" are almost pure theater. He's hyping minor or inconsequential effects with modern internet technology, hoping to earn a profit on licensing. To give just two examples:
  a. Reversing the polarity of a toroidal coil has no effect on anything external to the coil. He portrays it is extraordinary that his pulse motor still turns in the same direction (an effect of timing, not polarity).
  b. He puts a "load" on the Orbo, not with a device that can measure the load, but with an assistant's thumb (??!!), while showing that the amp and voltage levels remain constant. Of course, those levels have nothing to do with work, which is measured in watts (current drain over time). In fact, his scopes show that the load decreases the time interval of the pulse.
3. He provides superficial teasers about the nature of his hi-tech plexiglass equipment, but never provides facts. In today's show, he observes that his Orb and a regular pulse motor "appear to be completely identical, but they're not" ... with no explanation of any of the differences. He shows a small variation in the Back EMF, which may be a result of any number of variations in the motor (timing, spacing, current, or resistance - which his assistant notably adjusts when the measurement switch is made).
4. As best I can determine, his Orb may actually produce "over unity" output, for one simple reason: he doesn't measure the amount of DE-magnetization of the "permanent" magnets, which is the primary power source. Because he's using high-flux magnets, the effect will take a long time to drain, bringing his motor to a very slow stop (no matter how much current he puts into the device).
As others have noted, his firm conviction is endearing and he really DOES hope it will work. At the same time, he's a huckster putting on a show that gives the impression that he's brought the Stargate ZPM (Zero Point Module) into reality. He won't prove anything, but he'll sucker a lot of "developers" into paying him for a few pages of instructions with a lot of flim-flam jargon and pretty pictures. That is, as he admits, his only purpose.
Thanks for chiming in. I can see how you might draw the conclusions you have.
However, the three "core principles" Mr. McCarthy enumerated are far from being "minor or inconsequential" effects, although I agree with you that he did nothing to support or explain their origin. If the effects he claims are real:
Zero CEMF
Inductance GAIN(!)
Performs Work
then, sir, Steorn "has it" and the only remaining questions are "how much" and "when."
He promises more, in fact, direct answers to some of the issues you raise (e.g. demagnetization?) and so stay tuned!
In the short run, please read my next article (working on it feverishly!) discussing today's demo in greater detail.
Creator: "... he did nothing to support or explain their origin."
Precisely my point: he makes assertions that aren't even evidenced or documented in his own experimental "show".
If he did anything even remotely comparable to the demonstrations offered by Jean-Louis Naudin, he might have an ounce of credibility: http://jnaudin.free.fr/steorn/
"He promises more ..."
He's been promising more for ... what .. three years? six years? They always fall far short of the hype and have never demonstrated his basic proposition: "free energy".
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