Topic: Presidential Campaign 2008
So You Think Ron Paul Can WIN? Think Again! The apathy and ignorance of Ron Paul's supporters could cost him the election.by creator
(Libertarian)
Friday, December 28, 2007
♣ Second in a series - *1* - *2* - *3* - *4* - *5* (coming soon!)
You've seen it with your own eyes: Ron Paul has more money, more on-the-ground support, and more enthusiasm among his supporters than any other presidential candidate. You've watched Ron Paul's meteoric rise despite concerted efforts of the bought-and-paid-for media to demonize him. You've personally seen hundreds, perhaps thousands of supporters come on board Dr. Paul's Freedom Train. Yet all the support, all the work, all the money -- it may all come to naught! Here's why:
It won't matter how many voters change their registration to the Republican party. It won't make a bit of difference how many Democrats cross the aisle. I could care less how many independents in New Hampshire cast a ballot for Dr. Paul. All the great caucus efforts in Iowa - so what? When the final count is in, when the votes are tallied, none of it will count -- unless the votes that are cast are counted, every one, accurately and honestly! And, even if by some fluke the votes are counted precisely, it will be irrelevant if they are not all accurately accumulated and honestly reported!
At the suggestion of Nolan Chart founder Walt Thiesen, I raised this issue -- "How The US Became A Third-World Country" -- several days ago to, what has been so far, a deafening silence. Walt brought it up again in his riveting dream-scenario "My Dream For The Ron Paul Campaign". Maybe you missed those? Please go back and read them now! Follow the links, and be afraid - be very afraid - that your labors for Dr. Paul may all be wasted!
Dare we chalk this up to apathy and ignorance? Apathy about the possibility of vote fraud. Ignorance about the ways and means the fraud will be accomplished. Is it possible that Ron Paul's army of supporters, frequently described by the traditional media as "rabid," "frenetic," etc., are just so fixated on their idol that they haven't thought about the next counter-move from the opposition? The trump card that could force us to fold in this all-too-important game?
Come on, people! Are we going to lose this one to fraud? Do you want to wake up on the morning after the election (wherever you are, and whatever date your primary or caucus may be) to hear media pundits crowing about how Ron Paul went down?
Rigged elections. Imagine that! America, the equivalent of any third-world country, no better than your typical banana republic tin-horn dictatorship. Harsh words? Yes! Written in the hope that they might stir us all to appropriate action!
Even in the state of California, where there have been serious efforts made to insure the integrity of elections, and where the Secretary of State at least seems to have her heart in the right place on election issues, indications of looming problems have recently arisen. For example, less than a week ago, this report came out:
Read the article. The summary is that the Registrar of Voters for San Diego County is a former sales rep for voting machine companies! Can you believe that the fox is now watching the hen-house? Worse yet, she has sued California Secretary of State Debra Bowen to prevent the recently mandated random 10% hand-audit of ballots in close races! If that doesn't raise your hackles, what will it take? How about this:
Lost in transit? You've got to be kidding! Do they think we just got off the boat? Did we? Can you smell a rat here, on the eve of the presidential primary elections?
The Wired story (<- follow link) about the lost software also has some very scary links below it, well worth following.
What will you and I do about this? There are too many ways that votes can be stolen right under our collective noses.
Let's at least do our homework. Check out the reference links embedded in "How The US Became A Third-World Country." Please look into what you can do to help out as a "fair election watchdog," and please report what you learn in the commentsbelow this article, for the benefit of other Ron Paul supporters. Let's work together to insure that this election is not stolen from Dr. Paul, or from anyone else for that matter!
Second in a series - *1* - *2* - *3* - *4* - *5* (coming soon!)
Copyright (c) 2007 by Dann McCreary (aka creator) - Permission to copy with attribution granted.
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2007 creator, all rights reserved.
Published: Friday, December 28, 2007
Last modified: Wednesday, January 9, 2008
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I feel your passion and the links you've provided will go a long way to help educate those not aware of the situation as well as the need to get the votes out of the black box. I'm involved in two MeetUp groups and this is a topic we continue to discuss and educate supporters on. I believe the word is getting around the campaign and articles such as this, combined with the links, will help continue the process of education and action.
For the primaries this has me slightly less concerned than the actual convention. The primary is merely a dog and pony show, not an actual election the RNC has to abide by. Even if the supporters all cast their votes outside of the black box (please do) it is still imperative there are enough Ron Paul delegates able to attend and actively participate in the convention.
A two edged sword toward nominating Ron Paul, properly casting our votes and having delegates to actively voice those votes at the convention. Thanks for the reminder!
Posted By: Helena Handbasket
Date: 2007-12-28 11:41:46
Haven't looked at the others, but WatchTheVote2008.com is the exactly right way to go. We simply need a couple hundred people in IA and NH each to simply collect precinct counts and report them reliably and immediately on the Internet. Then when the media give us "their" counts, we have legitimate, contemporaneous reason to challenge the whole process.
Remember-- whoever counts the votes has the power. But that maxim cuts both ways! If WE count the votes WE reclaim the power!
Please sign up at WatchTheVote2008.com today, or the private vote counting program of your choice.
I wholeheartedly share your concern, so I'll visit the references in your article, but first I want to pass along info regarding the "National Clean Elections Lawsuit" (N-CEL) and would encourage everyone to do the same and keep close watch on its progress. The Docket can be seen at (Link Edited For Length), scroll to the bottom for its current status; or visit the home page at www.ncel.w4sp.com
I'm no lawyer, but it looks by my reading as if judgment will not be timely enough for the primaries (or most of them) but with dedication maybe through this and other avenues we can have a fair election. Thanks for bringing attention to this, again, and let's keep at it until we're sure our votes are counted!
This is so scary! My heart aches when I think about what will become of us if we do not fight this tyranny. The thing is, there are people out there that are fighting to keep our elections clean just no popular support for these people. I am the lead plaintiff in Michigan for the National Clean Elections Lawsuit and I really feel alone sometimes. Most of my friends seem to look at me like I am an alien when I tell them about it. When I tell people about it, more often than not, I am told that I’m strange. It stuns me that in this country, that I love so much, it is considered strange to stand up to injustice.
Press releases were sent out to every media outlet in Michigan and not a single peep. I was overjoyed when I read your article and spotted the link to (Link Edited For Length) at the bottom. I would like to thank you for being the first columnist to mention NCEL (that I have seen). There are some radio interviews on the subject but it still almost seems top secret.
For those that are unfamiliar with NCEL, I will give you a brief overview. It’s a lawsuit filed in all the states that seeks to institute open and verifiable elections & primaries. I will not go into detail (Any good American would make it a point to learn about this anyway) but our requests are based on very simple and common sense procedures.
What I don’t get is that nobody seems to care that their elected officials are fighting every action, every lawsuit tooth and nail. Listen to what I am saying! Your elected officials are fighting to keep every last scrap of a system that has been shown, time and time again, to be ripe with fraud. These people can only continue to stay in office because of apathy. This lawsuit could potentially stop every primary in the country until open and verifiable means are in place. I am curious to see the news coverage when this happens.
Please support this lawsuit. Call your local media and demand that this is covered. Call your representatives and demand that they support the lawsuit. Donate to We The People. Start supporting the plaintiffs in your state. Please help!
We've been discussing voter fraud for a long time in our Ron Paul Meetup groups as well as in every meeting I've attended recently. This is a very big deal and anybody who's followed politics for a while knows what a real threat it is. Thanks for spreading the word.
Posted By: Brian Billings
Date: 2007-12-28 14:37:48
I don't know if this could be useful, but it seems to me that the anti-Paul crowd on the internet has been writing quite extensively on the subject of the "computer-savvy Ron Paul supporters" that are capable of manipulating on-line polls.
If a LONG list of writings, posted by honest Americans expressing concern or belief that computers can be easily used to skew the tallies of polls/elections, could help accelerate some kind of legal action (like a petetition does), the anti-Paul crowd may have provided just that.
I don't know much about computers, but if someone knows how to quickly search for, and accumulate, this kind of literature on the internet, it might be useful.
Maybe this is a useless suggestion, but I thought I'd post it anyway - just in case it is not.
Hi , I live in the UK, I was wondering how I could possibly help?
I did have some ideas about this a while ago. The key it seems to me is an online, same day as voting, co-ordinated cross candidate action drive, that tracks the number of voters entering the voting station. I know for example that Obama fans, although he is an establishment candidate are worried by the prospect of votes seemingly move in Hillary's direction at the Democrat voting machines. As are the supporters of Mike Gravel and Dennis Kucinich.
There is if candidate supporters can co-operate a chance that a citizens for transparent votes group can be formed for the benefit of both democrat and republican 'truth' candidates. It would take preparation a state H.Q. where information could be calculated and sent back out to voters and to other state H.Q's, it would require a maximum of eight people per voting station for verfification aswell as if possible some local media either radio or T.V. to garner some attention amongst citizens.
A website would be required so that those across the country can view real time what the turnout is like, this way the establishment can't go wildly overboard like they did with Pat Buchanan.
Thanks, Great Article!!
The revolution is becoming popular over here, people just love Ron Paul.
As an American citizen that is currently living in a country (and no...I am not comfortable including the name of the country) that has already lost all of the freedoms being discussed here (speech, unlimited access to the internet, and yes...a believable vote count etc.), I STRONGLY urge you to take this article AND this election seriously.
Personally, I believe Ron Paul could be the last chance U.S. citizens have (if it isn't ALREADY too late) to right this sinking ship.
Freedom is NOT free...it must not only be earned, but it must be FOREVER GUARDED once it has been earned.
Also, I don't think I need to remind anyone here that even if Ron Paul does become our next leader, and I certainly hope to God that he does...we are going to have to continue to help him (by remaining alert and hounding our representatives) to get anything of any real worth accomplished while he is in office.
We all have an obligation to ourselves, and our country, to not further squander the freedoms we have inherited from the founders and all of those patriots that have died in defense of our Constitution.
Myself, I found out about Ron Paul from an acquaintance (someone I've never even met in person) via email. Since then, I've emailed a link to my entire list, and I tell everyone that I talk to about him.
Well...enough for this rant, and God bless the U.S.A., Ron Paul, and humanity (in my opinion, they're closely related).
What if we (Ron Paul voters) wear something as a signal, such as an orange (or any bright color) shirt or scarf, or armband, or cap... It is illegal to wear anything that has a candidate's name, but this should not be against the rules... Anyway, if 70-80% of the voters are in orange, and the polls "count" RP at 10-12%, then this would be obvious that there was some "Hank-Panky"... It wouldn't be too difficult to film this at each precinct...
This is something us grassroots supporters can do that won't do any harm to whatever HQ has decided to do... This would not have any negative impact on any other ideas and would be something cheap and easy for any individual to do...
I saw this done in the Ukraine about 3 or 4 years ago and it seems like a good idea (from a grassroot's point of view!)
Of course, this will not stop any vote fraud, but would add evidence to help prove "problems"... I don't see how this could hurt, and it has the potential to help!!! So far, I have not received any positive (or negative) responses to my suggestion... Anyone care to comment???
As always there are conspiracy theorists out there and you sound like one of the bigger ones. If you had any background in voting machines you would know that they are extremely challenging to mechanically get into. In addition they aren't networked together for any abundant cheating scheme. And then you'd have to have plenty of time to access them and have the ability to reprogram them. I'm just sick and tired of those like you prognosticating that someone has cheated all of us when the challenge to change votes is nearly impossible. Robbing a Brinks truck would be far easier.
Here's another gutless American flapping his gums.
well week boys, if they don't do it right we get our guns and go down and recount them again our selves and take this country back this is going to be the only way if Ron doesn't win. They think we don't have the balls to, that's why they do what they do. gov.should fear their people not the people fearing their gov.... Watch V for vendetta and you'll see the bigger picture, If you want to see it and your not a coward
"As always there are conspiracy theorists out there and you sound like one of the bigger ones. If you had any background in voting machines you would know that they are extremely challenging to mechanically get into. In addition they aren't networked together for any abundant cheating scheme. And then you'd have to have plenty of time to access them and have the ability to reprogram them. I'm just sick and tired of those like you prognosticating that someone has cheated all of us when the challenge to change votes is nearly impossible. Robbing a Brinks truck would be far easier."
K.C. obviously knows nothing about the studies done by the BBC showing massive voting irregularities in Florida in 2000 and Ohio in 2004. I guess a realist is equivalent to a "good german" or somebody who plugs their ears so as not to hear the fiddle whilst Rome is burning. Your trust in the establishment is a major reason why we are in the mess we're in. I suggest shedding your perceived "realism" and start doubting and asking questions. If history has taught us anything, it is to never, ever trust the establishment. Power corrupts.......
In response to realist I suggest you view the DVD "Invisible Ballot" which is available on the Internet. Please consider having an open mind and inform yourself about the more recent finding of Ohio's EVEREST review of voting machines. Ohio's electronic voting machines did not meet minimum industry standards for computer security. Fairly simple techniques such as using a magnet or a personal digital assistant could be used by a voter to compromise vote results. It has been known for years that electronic vote tallies can be easily modified using a computer programs that were designed to not leave any evidence of an attack.Malicious software can be built into the voting machines or can be introduced by a computer virus that spreads from computer to computer. In the absence of meaningful audits thousands of votes can be altered undetected by a few insiders. By and large BOE's do not audit the machine tallies against the paper ballots where paper audit trails exist.
Unaudited voting machines are vehicles of political manipulation. Electronic vote counting is not transparent and therefore can never be an acceptable method of vote tabulation. Touchscreen voting machines should be decertified in all states period. Optical scans of paper ballots are acceptable only as a check on hand counted paper ballots counted at the precincts. We need the blogs and MSM to expose the corruption and incompetence that threatens our democracy at the federal, state, local and corporate level. Jack Abramoff represented Diebold at the committee that established rules for electronic voting systems. That committee was run by Ohio's Bob Ney another convicted felon and the lead sponsor of HAVA. Diebold's CEO Wally O'Dell who promised to deliver Ohio to Bush resigned amidst securities fraud litigation. Ken Blackwell was Secretary of State while co-chairing the Bush/Cheney campaign. John Conyers report on What Went Wrong in Ohio described massive and unprecedented voter irregularities in 2004 ;-) caused by intentional misconduct and illegal behavior much of it involving Blackwell. Convicted felon Jeff Dean programmed Diebold's optiscan software. Ohio Board of Election Director Matt Damschroder accepted $10,000 from a Diebold intermediary and donated it to the Ohio Republican party. The Ohio state legislature removed any audit requirement of the electronic voting machines when research documenting serious problems with the security and reliability of electronic voting machines had been available for years. It seems to me there was a lot of coordinated, suspicious and/or unlawful behavior leading up to and following the 2004 election in Ohio. Now that local Ohio BOE's illegally destroyed the 2004 ballots, we will never know who won in 2004. What is clear is that our representative democracy lost. Teresa Blakely
Hello, you good folks. It seems that most of you are good Republicans who are waking up to the election perfidy that has embraced this nation since, at least, the HAVA act.
Two good sources of voting news and background on the fight for verifiable elections are "Daily Voting News" and the "BradBlog". Some names to search for on Bradblog are Nancy Tobi, Bev Harris, and Kathy Dopp.
The voter's rights circle has matured to the point that people are debating and arguing the details. You know a movement is coming of age when people are arguing with each other.
http://www.votersunite.org/news.asp
http://bradblog.com
Check them out, the fight for majority rule has been going on for a while, and intrenched neo-cons in control of voting machinery are fighting like maniacs to keep us from counting our votes..
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