Truth Realm
columnist: creator

Reader Comments:

Posted By: Brian
Date: 2008-04-04 13:38:26

I recently bought another car, and it began to dawn on me how many hoops you need to jump through just to drive.

You need a Drivers License.  To obtain that you need a SS number, and a birth certificate, to pass a written test, fill out a log form to go with a 'learners permit' then pass a skills test.  Each step has it's own associated fees and costs to the state.

To buy a car you need said photo ID and you need to pay fees to the state to transfer the title.  In my state you also need to pay sales tax on a *USED* car from a private seller, based upon the 'NADA' book value of said car.  Regardless of the actual price paid between two private parties. (This particular car I was the 4th time that car had provided the state sales tax revenue. At least I can take some comfort in that each time it was a slightly smaller amount.)

The car needs to be registered, to register the car you need to pay the state a fee, and you must have proof of insurance.

I need to purchase a plate from the state.

I must obtain private insurance and be able to prove it.

I must pay fees to the state to keep current state inspection tags on my car at all times.

I also must pay fees to the state to current emissions tags on my car.   (I won't even touch on how expensive EM can be to pass)

After a while it starts to get a little absurd.

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Posted By: Scott from Oregon
Date: 2008-04-04 15:09:35

UNless you live on a deserted island, freedom is maximized by "rules" and "laws".

I like to demonstrate that by showing this video-- [link edited for length]

 

As in everything, it boils down to rationality and balance.

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Posted By: trd
Date: 2008-04-04 15:12:49

creator:

As long as you are not caught, you can do all of the things on your list.  If you are cought then you are a 'criminal' even though there was no victim.  So, yes, we are not as free as most think we are.  Our only advantage is that at least we have a little bit of freedom left as compared to most places in the wrold, unfortunately today's trend is toward the loosing of our freedoms.

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Posted By: Jessie Jones
Date: 2008-04-04 17:25:05

Listen this is where intelligence flirts with ignorance. Your argument should have a constitutional backing. The problem from the top down is:

Federal Power vs. States Rights

The Federal government has no authority to regulate the items listed above excluding SS but SS is economically unsound and on that basis should be abolished.

Therefore, if I live in a state where "we" collectively want licensed drivers or licensed hand gun purchases that is okay but it must jump through two hoops...

Must be constitutional

Must be voted for by the majority with protection for the minority.

AKA, the problem is not that these regulations exist. It's that these regulations exist without the test of the constitution and without the consent of the people only with that of those who "represent" them. If they went through the proper process, they would be badges of achievement versus yokes of oppression. I.E. I can buy a gun without a license but inorder to operate a semi or fully automatic weapon, I must be licensed to use it effectively. I can drive without a license but if I want to use the highway or drive a specialized vehicle like an 18 wheeler, I must be licensed. I can buy anything to put in my body i.e. marijuana or cocaine if I want but if I injure another I face strict punishment, if I want to get off of the addiction, I must pay for it solely myself, and if I want to sell it I must be licensed and regulated.

I think in these arguments we forget that government does have a role to play in society. Civilization and governance are forever united. Our goal isn't the abolition of the existance of government rather the reversion of it's role to a constitutional role and advising that if we are to change it from it's original form we must take it through it's proper prosess. If we want to take on the role of nation building and an interventionist foreign policy no problem...we can do that...just compare it to the constitution to see whether it fits it's mandate or whether an amendment is necessary and you have to have the peoples backing for the proposal...

More briefly, our problem need not be with the  positions of our opponents rather the shortcut used to get there.

 

So structure your arguments more effectively next time please...thanks.

 

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Posted By: Logical Premise
Date: 2008-04-04 21:05:56

This article is so full of ignorance I have to respond:

Your list:

• Raw milk is supposedly good for you? Oh, yes, this is put forth by the WESTON A PRICE foundation, the same NUTJOBS that claimed Mad Cow was something the government had invented and that the feed system was a neccessary evil. They claim raw milk helps with asthma in a trial with NO double blind and NO independant verifications, and you people eat it up.
• If your child is dying of cancer and you want to try some snake oil that will kill them, I think you should allowed to do so -- and then tried for first degree murder. Simply because you are ignorant of science and medicine does not mean you have "rights" to murder your children. Jehova's Witnesses believe blood transfusions are a sin against God -- tell me, if you're wrong, do you honestly think God will say "It's okay you basically murdered your child because you *thought* it was okay?"
• I think if you don't want an SSN, you should neither pay for nor benefit from Social Security and/or Medicare. That's only fair. Doing so, however, should ALSO mean you cannot apply for such benefits at a later time, and the people who do pay SSN taxes should get a tax break.
• If you want to eat, drink, or smoke abusive substances that may make you act in a violent and criminal manner, NO, you do not have that right. I , for one, cannot for the life of me understand the reluctance to execute drunk drivers and the IDIOCY which allows people to drive drunk multiple times. Expand this to drugs such as crack cocaine and your "rights" violate mine.
• Don't want to serve your country? Don't give me ANY patriotic crap or talk about the Constitution again. If you don't like signing up for the Selective Service, your'e a coward. End of story, period.
• Jury Summons is a duty of the people. If you really have a problem with this, we can bring back military tribunals, us Statists would love that a LOT more.

Liberty

• Tell me, would you fly on a plane without the pilot knowing how to fly? What if he just SAID he could fly? What about a boat? You want to go on a cruise with some idiot who is channeling Captain Smith of the Titanic? When your driving incompetancy can kill ME, yes, you need a license. (Using it as ID, however, is completely asinine). 
• Get on a plane with a box cutter = 9/11. Since we can't have enough air marshals since you goddamned liberty freaks hate taxes, and since if we hired a Private Company to do it we'd end up with Blackwater shooting up whole planes of people, I can live without the VITAL NEED of a pocketknife on an airplane for a few hours.
• You have never been able to start a business without filling out at least a few forms for at least 100 years.
• Drive a car without permission (e.g. a "license")
• Buy a gun without paperwork, or buy explosives and poisons without paperwork? Tell me, O Libertarian, if you allow such things to happen, how EXACTLY will you deal with all the idiots who abuse this blind trust? LECTURE them on Freedom?

I won't even bother to go on.

Nine times out of ten, you forget the role of government. It's to provide control and regulation. The problem isn't the regulation, or even lack of Constitutionality. The reason there wasn't a Constitutional need for this shit back in the 1700's is people weren't BATSHIT FUCKING CRAZY back then. And they are now.

If you think a better society is one where everyone can do all the things listed above -- feel free. I wouldn't want to live there, because the above list is only plausible if most people in society are mature, reflective, and stop to consider ramifications and make an honest effort to live safely, honestly, and lawfully -- and if you think that's you're average American, you have more mental problems than I can solve. 

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Posted By: Gary
Date: 2008-04-04 22:50:21

Good reality check for many. It reminds me of a simple video I did, You Think We're Free?;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uF1qpdsfxyc

I'm off for a week long journey with no Internet, when I return I hope to unveil and soft-launch a new community for liberty-minded folks. I'll share it with you when I get home. Thanks for helping to attempt to pry the eyes of the sleeping majority open.

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Posted By: censoredagain
Date: 2008-04-04 23:46:57

Logical Premise I have to defend Creator's post against your socialist take on his test.   I admit it was very elementary and a bit on the extreme side but he does make some very valid points.

• Raw milk is supposedly good for you? Oh, yes, this is put forth by the WESTON A PRICE foundation, the same NUTJOBS that claimed Mad Cow was something the government had invented and that the feed system was a necessary evil. They claim raw milk helps with asthma in a trial with NO double blind and NO independent verifications, and you people eat it up.

The point isn't about the healthfulness of raw milk nor about biased research on the matter; the point is that the government forbids the commerce of said product.  The government isn't needed to protect an informed buyer of raw milk.  The point is informed individuals do not need a nanny watching out for their best interest in regards to raw milk. One should have the right to buy raw milk if they so choose.

• If your child is dying of cancer and you want to try some snake oil that will kill them, I think you should allowed to do so -- and then tried for first degree murder. Simply because you are ignorant of science and medicine does not mean you have "rights" to murder your children. Jehovah's Witnesses believe blood transfusions are a sin against God -- tell me, if you're wrong, do you honestly think God will say "It's okay you basically murdered your child because you *thought* it was okay?"

Keep in mind that much of the work that a doctor does is making educated guesses.   There are many misdiagnoses in your world of science and medicine.  If someone trusts non western medicine more so the conventional western medicine they should not be coerced by the government to participate in any government sanctioned health care process. And it is the government interference in the heath care system which causes the costs to go up.

• I think if you don't want an SSN, you should neither pay for nor benefit from Social Security and/or Medicare. That's only fair. Doing so, however, should ALSO mean you cannot apply for such benefits at a later time, and the people who do pay SSN taxes should get a tax break.

I agree except for the those that participate in SS should get a tax break.  There shouldn't be an income tax at all.

• If you want to eat, drink, or smoke abusive substances that may make you act in a violent and criminal manner, NO, you do not have that right. I , for one, cannot for the life of me understand the reluctance to execute drunk drivers and the IDIOCY which allows people to drive drunk multiple times. Expand this to drugs such as crack cocaine and your "rights" violate mine.

Talk about ignorant, you just described alcohol and anyone with a basic understanding of 20th century history knows how the banning of alcohol went.   People now can buy beer et. al. but there are laws against being drunk in public so to should it be with other drugs be it pot coke or toad licking.  The possession, trade and ingestion there of should only concern the government when an individual rather high, drunk or sober trespasses against another and that includes being under the influence while in public. 

• Don't want to serve your country? Don't give me ANY patriotic crap or talk about the Constitution again. If you don't like signing up for the Selective Service, you're a coward. End of story, period.

He never said anything about not serving in the military only about the coercion of guys having to sign up for selective service.  And you can get off you high horse of military service as well on this account because not since WWII with the exceptions of Afghanistan and maybe Panama has the military  been used to defend the American people American Liberty or the American Constitution All other wars and conflicts are mere tools of foreign policy only fools do not see that.

Liberty

• You have never been able to start a business without filling out at least a few forms for at least 100 years.

That just means the country has been wrong for 100 years it does not mean it is right.

• Drive a car without permission (e.g. a "license")

I admit he is stretching on this one.  I know one can drive without a license so long as one is not driving on public roads or across the neighbors lawn.

• Buy a gun without paperwork, or buy explosives and poisons without paperwork? Tell me, O Libertarian, if you allow such things to happen, how EXACTLY will you deal with all the idiots who abuse this blind trust? LECTURE them on Freedom?

I do believe that a complete criminal and mental health background check should be done but I am apprehensive about registration because one reason for having a gun is to defend one's self and property from the government.  Registration can be used by the government to fend off needed revolutions against a corrupt tyrannical government.

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